Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates recently shared candid thoughts about his relationship with Steve Jobs, Apple, and pivotal moments in tech history during an interview with Axios. The conversation coincides with the release of Gates’ new memoir, Source Code, which chronicles the early days of the computer industry.
Bill Gates says Steve Jobs “should have been an actor”
Reflecting on Steve Jobs, Gates called the late Apple co-founder a “singular figure” who had an extraordinary ability to captivate people.”He should have been an actor,” Gates said. “He really ran the reality distortion field like no one else.”
Despite Jobs’ persuasive charisma, Gates claims he was never under his spell. “I always said to Steve, ‘Look, I’m a minor wizard. You’re a major wizard. You can cast spells I can’t cast, but because I’m a minor wizard, your spells don’t work on me. I see the bullshit, that you’re just mesmerizing these people.'”
Gates recalled a particularly blunt exchange after Jobs unveiled the NeXT computer, a machine that struggled commercially. “This thing is a slow, expensive computer with an overpriced black case,” Gates told Jobs at the time.
While Gates admired Jobs’ “messianic” skills in marketing and leadership, he also noted the late Apple co-founder’s lack of technical expertise. “Steve’s achievements are all the more impressive when you know that he couldn’t look at a piece of code and know what it was,” Gates said. “He was never an engineer. Woz [Steve Wozniak] was a real engineer — I mean, a hardcore engineer.”
Steve Jobs had “many skills that I didn’t”: Bill Gates
Despite their differing skill sets and approaches, Gates acknowledged that he and Jobs shared one key talent: the ability to inspire their teams. “Clearly, he had so many skills that I didn’t, but we were both a little bit pied pipers in terms of getting people to work ridiculous hours,” Gates said.
The conversation also touched on Microsoft’s pivotal role in saving Apple from bankruptcy in 1997, when it invested in the struggling company and pledged support. Gates said he has no regrets about the move. “It was good that Apple recovered and made incredible contributions,” he said. “Once you get to the mobile thing, then Apple becomes every bit as important as Microsoft. It wasn’t up until then. They were more of a niche.”
However, Gates admitted that selling Microsoft’s 5% stake in Apple, acquired as part of the deal, was a mistake. “I wish we’d maintained that 5% ownership,” he said with a laugh. “It was foolish, foolish to sell it, but when we’re worrying about all sorts of antitrust things, we sold it for what now looks like nothing. And we owned part of Facebook for a while, too.”